Time Seal

Everyone has a favorite trap card. What is yours?
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Rowwdy Yisb
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Re: Time Seal

Post by Rowwdy Yisb » Fri Oct 09, 2015 12:30 pm

This card is one of the many examples of bad card design. I hope I never see this card in Advanced format.
ChaosDraGon00 wrote:Rowwdy's right

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xion52998
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Re: Time Seal

Post by xion52998 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 4:02 pm

Trentfire wrote:I'm relieved at least some people are on my side ;) A lot of cards are a +0 or even better and are splashable, like Bottomless and Torrential. And even if they don't go off because they got popped by MST, then it's still a +0. And sacking someone with this is almost similar to a Vanity's Emptiness sack. I feel like people disregard this card wayyy to quickly and some people think the game is the same as 10 years ago. Yes, it was banned for a REASON, so was Goyo and United We Stand! I feel like some people don't even read the arguments I gave, but instead just post useless one-liners. Skipping the opponent's turn with Time seal? Just no:P A lot of decks can even generate cards just by using their graveyard or re-using the effect of a monster already on the field. Time Seal to ONE. Just ONE! The statistics of this showing up in your hand AND at a useful time(when you're not behind) are not that high.

Splashable? Yes, that's nothing new.
OP? By far not
Sacky? Less than a lot of cards i see being played today


I do appreciatie everyon's view on the card however:)
Bottomless and torrential are responsive and can be played around. The only way to play around time seal is to negate it.
Vanity's and other power traps are limited for a reason. Vanity's especially should be banned.
Goyo isn't as strong anymore, yes, but is still the go to level 6 synchro.
Yes, i agree with the whole skipping your opponent's turn thing. But this + soul charge is extremely broke, because you can generate more card advantage without losing your bp.
Limit this to one? then why not trap dustshoot? or confiscation/forceful sentry? "in this day/age, you set everything/pendulum everything out duh." Just because the card might not help in a losing situation doesn't mean it isnt good everywhere else and isnt bad design.

edit: oh and stuff like mst don't stop the opponent from playing, and while it is a +0, the card is necessary to prevent locks and to clear backrow without becoming too much. also not every neck needs it, every deck could use time seal except for fringe stuff like igknights who only run 1-2 absurd floodgates
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Re: Time Seal

Post by sgtc1 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:01 pm

Trentfire wrote:To be honest, I'll admit immediately that I am somewhat biased towards this card. I love grind decks and grind games and I feel like they represent how the game should be played. I feel like Time Seal fits the grind match perfectly. Anyways, for those who don't know Time Seal, here is the effect:

Normal Trap
Skip the Draw Phase of your opponent's next turn.

Currently, this card is banned, and I believe it has been banned since 2006'ish. Time Seal was mostly famous for it's draw lock with Tsukyomi and Mask of Darkness if I recall correctly. The game was also quite slow back then.

First of all, this card is fairly slow in TODAY's game. How? The way to use it, is exactly the same as when it was legal... Yes the game is alot faster, but that does little sometimes to negate the brokenness of this card. You can't set this card, and activate it during your opponents' Draw Phase. If you activate this card after the turn you set it, it'll affect the NEXT turn your opponent would've drawn. Well you have to know when to use it, to stop your opponent from getting a much needed draw. You don't just use it whenever you can... the same can be said with using any card skillfully. This means that your opponent still has a turn on full power while you set yourself back 1 card for the remainder of their turn and your next turn. You also might invite them to OTK you, because they know that they won't draw next turn and might start falling behind. Anyway, should you survive, after that, Time Seal becomes a +0. Is that so awful to be ban worthy? Even more so, the game state can change a lot within two turns. That Time Seal could've been a Comp evac device that bounced a Dante back into the extra deck. Time Seal is purely focused on raw card advantage, while it has no other function whatsoever.
Yes many times it can be "Not as broken as you'd like", but it can still win games. At worst it's a +0.
Secondly, it is a guaranteed +0, with a CHANCE of becoming a +1 if your opponent chooses to blind MST/pop(that's the case with EVERY chainable card BTW!). Don't you guys feels that there should be a punishment for blind MST'ing every day all day? Don't even get us started on blind MSTing.... I feel like the fact that a set card COULD be a Time Seal promotes more skillful plays.

Thirdly, I feel like the once epic combo with Mask and Tsukiomy is near-impossible to pull off nowadays. I requires a fair amount of set-up, and extra deck monsters are able to get rid of any thread nowadays, not to mention the popping abillity's most tier decks have today, like Shadoll and Burning Abyss. This makes me think that Time Seal might make a bigger impact on lower tier decks and/or casual decks, but so does Raigeki!
Oh we're not worried about the stupid combo. The card by itself can be a huge detriment to your game plan.
Fourth, some people may argue that you can generate advantage during your turn, establish a field and then activate this during your End Phase to cripple the opponent from coming back. Uhmm, yeah? Seems like a pretty well thought of strategy. And the same could be said for Vanity's emptiness:P
So.... you're comparing apples to oranges? Uhm, Vanity's is limited right now, and for good reason... it's not that far off from time seal. -,-
Lastly, I feel like this card is way less splashable than some people make it up to be. This card doesn't advance your plays, it's a horrible topdeck and the advantage you can gain from it are very minimal(O god a +1 for the opponent? Well I think I'll just activate my Shadoll fusion and go +3 to even it out!:P)
I don't think that decks like Shadoll, Kozmo, Qliphort or anything Pendulum related would feel like this is worth playing. Though I understand decks like BA and Sattellars would want to play it. Any decks with some kind of backrow can use it... which is almost any deck. Again, it can just win games for you, and if not it'll slow down your opponent.

As you should've noticed by now I'd like to see Time Seal at 1 again, nothing more, nothing less. Like I said, I'm biased, since it would fit my deck perfectly both thematically and mechanichally:P But I mean...COME ON:P You can never say this is BROKEN like it used to be almost 10 years ago.
It sorta is tho... the game has changed. That makes the significance of some cards less relevant. This is not one of those cards.
Honestly, imo, if this card did come back, there would just be lots of hype... that's about it. Some people are going to run it for lolz or whatever, or maybe they honestly believe it's really broken. It shouldn't come back tho, it'll just be broken af. I have a feeling a great deal of people would run it with a small amount of people advertising against it. It really does depend. But this card is soooo irrelevant. I doubt it'll come back. It could maybe as a surprise, but I highly doubt it.
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Re: Time Seal

Post by xion52998 » Fri Oct 09, 2015 5:36 pm

sgtc1 wrote:
Trentfire wrote:To be honest, I'll admit immediately that I am somewhat biased towards this card. I love grind decks and grind games and I feel like they represent how the game should be played. I feel like Time Seal fits the grind match perfectly. Anyways, for those who don't know Time Seal, here is the effect:

Normal Trap
Skip the Draw Phase of your opponent's next turn.

Currently, this card is banned, and I believe it has been banned since 2006'ish. Time Seal was mostly famous for it's draw lock with Tsukyomi and Mask of Darkness if I recall correctly. The game was also quite slow back then.

First of all, this card is fairly slow in TODAY's game. How? The way to use it, is exactly the same as when it was legal... Yes the game is alot faster, but that does little sometimes to negate the brokenness of this card. You can't set this card, and activate it during your opponents' Draw Phase. If you activate this card after the turn you set it, it'll affect the NEXT turn your opponent would've drawn. Well you have to know when to use it, to stop your opponent from getting a much needed draw. You don't just use it whenever you can... the same can be said with using any card skillfully. This means that your opponent still has a turn on full power while you set yourself back 1 card for the remainder of their turn and your next turn. You also might invite them to OTK you, because they know that they won't draw next turn and might start falling behind. Anyway, should you survive, after that, Time Seal becomes a +0. Is that so awful to be ban worthy? Even more so, the game state can change a lot within two turns. That Time Seal could've been a Comp evac device that bounced a Dante back into the extra deck. Time Seal is purely focused on raw card advantage, while it has no other function whatsoever.
Yes many times it can be "Not as broken as you'd like", but it can still win games. At worst it's a +0.
Secondly, it is a guaranteed +0, with a CHANCE of becoming a +1 if your opponent chooses to blind MST/pop(that's the case with EVERY chainable card BTW!). Don't you guys feels that there should be a punishment for blind MST'ing every day all day? Don't even get us started on blind MSTing.... I feel like the fact that a set card COULD be a Time Seal promotes more skillful plays.

Thirdly, I feel like the once epic combo with Mask and Tsukiomy is near-impossible to pull off nowadays. I requires a fair amount of set-up, and extra deck monsters are able to get rid of any thread nowadays, not to mention the popping abillity's most tier decks have today, like Shadoll and Burning Abyss. This makes me think that Time Seal might make a bigger impact on lower tier decks and/or casual decks, but so does Raigeki!
Oh we're not worried about the stupid combo. The card by itself can be a huge detriment to your game plan.
Fourth, some people may argue that you can generate advantage during your turn, establish a field and then activate this during your End Phase to cripple the opponent from coming back. Uhmm, yeah? Seems like a pretty well thought of strategy. And the same could be said for Vanity's emptiness:P
So.... you're comparing apples to oranges? Uhm, Vanity's is limited right now, and for good reason... it's not that far off from time seal. -,-
Lastly, I feel like this card is way less splashable than some people make it up to be. This card doesn't advance your plays, it's a horrible topdeck and the advantage you can gain from it are very minimal(O god a +1 for the opponent? Well I think I'll just activate my Shadoll fusion and go +3 to even it out!:P)
I don't think that decks like Shadoll, Kozmo, Qliphort or anything Pendulum related would feel like this is worth playing. Though I understand decks like BA and Sattellars would want to play it. Any decks with some kind of backrow can use it... which is almost any deck. Again, it can just win games for you, and if not it'll slow down your opponent.

As you should've noticed by now I'd like to see Time Seal at 1 again, nothing more, nothing less. Like I said, I'm biased, since it would fit my deck perfectly both thematically and mechanichally:P But I mean...COME ON:P You can never say this is BROKEN like it used to be almost 10 years ago.
It sorta is tho... the game has changed. That makes the significance of some cards less relevant. This is not one of those cards.
Honestly, imo, if this card did come back, there would just be lots of hype... that's about it. Some people are going to run it for lolz or whatever, or maybe they honestly believe it's really broken. It shouldn't come back tho, it'll just be broken af. I have a feeling a great deal of people would run it with a small amount of people advertising against it. It really does depend. But this card is soooo irrelevant. I doubt it'll come back. It could maybe as a surprise, but I highly doubt it.
Exactly^^
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Re: Time Seal

Post by Trentfire » Sat Oct 10, 2015 4:03 am

Thanks everyone:) I appreciate that everyone can give their arguments without this becoming a ''omg you so stupid'' thread;) I can understand the things you guys said! A random question: would you rahter have this or snatch steal in the game?:)

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Re: Time Seal

Post by dracostrike » Sat Oct 10, 2015 5:31 am

I actually saw someone get DQ'ed last Nats for having this card in their deck XD Sounds like they didn't get the memo....
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Re: Time Seal

Post by sgtc1 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 7:36 am

Trentfire wrote:Thanks everyone:) I appreciate that everyone can give their arguments without this becoming a ''omg you so stupid'' thread;) I can understand the things you guys said! A random question: would you rahter have this or snatch steal in the game?:)
Hmmmm. Idk, would u rather be stabbed in the side of your neck/shoulder or in your chest?
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Re: Time Seal

Post by xion52998 » Sat Oct 10, 2015 9:55 am

Trentfire wrote:Thanks everyone:) I appreciate that everyone can give their arguments without this becoming a ''omg you so stupid'' thread;) I can understand the things you guys said! A random question: would you rahter have this or snatch steal in the game?:)
Probably this, because snatch steal is searchable
but they are both dumb cards
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